Help with fan timer (ceiling fan / whole house fan in utility room)


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Old 11-12-16, 05:17 PM
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Help with fan timer (ceiling fan / whole house fan in utility room)

My new house has an Intermatic KM2ST-1G timer installed. It isn't working correctly (dial won't advance), so I thought I could switch it out for a digital version. I bought an Intermatic EI600WC as a replacement, but have been unable to figure out how to wire the new timer.

From the wall is a single Romex cable with four wires, black, red, tan and copper.

The copper was not connected to anything, and black was connected to the timer as "Line", the red as "Load" and the tan as "Neutral".

I assumed this was a three-way connection, and the found instructions for same on the new timer. New instructions said to connect "Common" to black, and then the other two wires to red and blue, copper to ground.

I assumed Neutral to be common, but that caused the timer to click on and off continuously. It seems I'm missing something here and don't wanna burn down my house.

It seemed easy as there was no new wiring. Just replacing one timer with another, but something is not right. Any help would be appreciated.
 
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Old 11-12-16, 06:19 PM
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You don't have a three way setup. Black is the incoming power (line), white (tan) is neutral, red is the fan (Load) and copper is ground, which goes to the green screw if there is one.

Cable Timer

Black Black
Red Blue
White N/C
N/C Red


That timer might be overkill for a fan. Often the simpler version with 4 or 5 buttons for 5,10,15,20 minutes are used.
 
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Old 11-12-16, 06:21 PM
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Common is the source hot. It should be the only wire that reads 120V to both neutral and ground.

Let us know if you need any more help.
 
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Old 11-12-16, 07:26 PM
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Thanks for the prompt replies.

The instructions said;

If a Single Switch Setup:
a. Connect one of the two wires from the wall to the black wire from the switch timer, using the twist connectors provided.
b. Connect the other wire from the wall to the blue wire from the
switch timer, using the twist connectors provided.
NOTE: The RED wire is not used in single-switch installations. Cap with a twist connector.
c. Connect the GREEN wire to the grounding screw in the box. If a plastic box, connect to ground as
supplied.

Which leaves me confused since the old timer used all three wires, and this installation only uses two. The room also has a rocker switch on the wall to turn on the fan, which is what I thought made this a three-way switch.
 
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Old 11-12-16, 07:49 PM
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The room also has a rocker switch on the wall to turn on the fan, which is what I thought made this a three-way switch.
Is it in another box in another part of the room? If not it isn't a 3-way.
From the wall is a single Romex cable with four wires, black, red, tan and copper.
No. That is black, red, white (ground) and if the other switch is in a different location means you have a dead end 3-way. We will need to know the wiring at the other switch in that case.
 
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Old 11-12-16, 08:10 PM
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Thanks Ray

The rocker switch is a couple feet away from the timer.

I thought (mistakenly I guess) that knowing how the original timer was wired, the wiring for the new timer would be obvious.
 
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Old 11-12-16, 08:24 PM
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Here's what it looked like when I started.
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I moved the black wire to the new timer before deciding that this timer was not indicated as 20A (as the old one is), and the instructions showed no option for three-way. So I returned the timer and now, armed with a new timer, still have no clue...
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Old 11-12-16, 08:33 PM
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The rocker switch is a couple feet away from the timer.
We need to see the wiring at that switch.
 
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Old 11-12-16, 08:41 PM
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Do I need to pull out all the wires? (They're tucked in so nicely)
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Old 11-12-16, 09:13 PM
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At the timer switch box and with the other switch on using a multimeter tell us the voltage between:
  • White and black
  • White and red

Then at the timer switch box and with the other switch off using a multimeter tell us the voltage between:
  • White and black
  • White and red
 
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Old 11-12-16, 09:14 PM
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Instructions for new timers says;

If a 3-Way Switch Setup:
NOTE: The distance between switch timer and remote switch must not
exceed 100 feet.
a. Locate the COMMON wire connected to first old switch. It might be attached to a different colored screw, or find markings on old switch.
b. Connect BLACK wire from switch timer to COMMON wire, using a twist connector.
c. Connect the other two wires from the old switch to the Blue and RED wires from the switch timer.
d. Connect the GREEN wire to the grounding screw in the box. If a plastic box, connect to ground as supplied.

I tried;
White from wall to Black in timer
Black from wall to Blue in timer
Red from wall to Red in timer

Flipped the circuit breaker and it flipped right back off
 
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Old 11-12-16, 09:24 PM
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Off
White and black 23 volts
White and red 0 volts

On
White and black 23 volts
White and red 23 volts
 
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Old 11-12-16, 10:43 PM
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Bet you are using a digital multimeter so the real reading is probably zero not twenty-three. Try red then black to ground also black to red.
 
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Old 11-12-16, 11:19 PM
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I surrender - thanks for trying.
 
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Old 11-13-16, 12:00 AM
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We just need to figure out why no power to the switch. Did the fan ever work before?
 
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Old 11-13-16, 12:09 AM
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The fan does work. The rocker switch operates it and the original analog timer operates it. The only part not working, is the dial does not advance itself. If I advance the dial manually, I can make it come on and off. Likewise, if I switch the override switch on the timer, I can make it come on and off.

The existing timer therefore, seems to be wired correctly and is indicated as black (line), red (load) and white (neutral). The failure of the dial to advance I believe to be a physical failure, not electrical.

I was hoping someone could tell me how to translate those colors to the new digital switch. I guess it's not that easy.
 
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Old 11-13-16, 12:22 AM
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The existing timer therefore, seems to be wired correctly and is indicated as black (line), red (load) and white (neutral).
If that were true you would have 120 volts between neutral and black with the remote switch on. You have said you don't have that. We really need to see how that three conductor cable is connected in the box for the remote switch.
 
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Old 11-13-16, 05:43 AM
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Which leaves me confused since the old timer used all three wires, and this installation only uses two.
The above quote is from your post #4.
The reason the old timer used all 3 wires is because it required a neutral, your new timer doesn't require a neutral.
This quote is also from your post #4 and the instructions are correct:

The instructions said;

If a Single Switch Setup:
a. Connect one of the two wires from the wall to the black wire from the switch timer, using the twist connectors provided.
b. Connect the other wire from the wall to the blue wire from the
switch timer, using the twist connectors provided.
NOTE: The RED wire is not used in single-switch installations. Cap with a twist connector.
c. Connect the GREEN wire to the grounding screw in the box. If a plastic box, connect to ground as
supplied.
So just use the black and blue wires from the new timer to the house Black and Red.
Don't use a 3-way timer.
 
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Old 11-13-16, 08:59 PM
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Thanks Brian. I will try again when I get a chance. I'll be sure to post here if I'm successful.

And to Ray's response, sorry I don't know how to use the multi-meter. Maybe if I knew better how to use that, I would know how to connect this stupid timer.
 
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Old 11-14-16, 06:09 AM
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You should be successful.
Cap off the neutral in the box, Cap off the Red wire of the dimmer.
Wire the switch just as you would a normal toggle switch, off/on.
The dimmer wires don't have a line and load, you can connect a dimmer wire to either wire from the house.
 
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Old 11-19-16, 02:13 PM
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Awesome Brian, that worked. Thanks Brian and Ray for your help.
 
 

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