Wiring Recommendations for Kitchen Remodel


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Old 08-23-17, 06:58 PM
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Wiring Recommendations for Kitchen Remodel

Going to be a full demo in the kitchen, down to the studs. Some wiring tasks are obvious. New 40 amp service to combo wall oven and microwave. 30 amp service for the dryer. 20 amp circuit to the island for a couple of outlets and to provide power to the cooktop (it's gas - power for the igniters only).

I'm also going to setup two 20 amp circuits for two countertop areas, and a 20 amp to be shared by the washer and a fridge. Finally, a 20 amp circuit to power 3 or 4 outlets in the breakfast area.

My question is this: Does code require that lighting and outlets be on separate circuits? For example, in the breakfast area, I'm installing an LED chandelier that draws not even an amp. Can this be wired into the outlet circuit or do I need to have a separate circuit for all lights in the kitchen (all LED)... kitchen, laundry, breakfast, under cabinet?

TIA
 
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Old 08-23-17, 07:48 PM
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and a 20 amp to be shared by the washer and a fridge
.
Dishwasher should be on its own 15 or 20 amp circuit as it normally draws more then 50% of a circuit. Fridge can also be on its own (many manufacturers require it) or on some other general purpose circuit. (perhaps existing)

Code does not require the lights to be separate from receptacles, however, they can not be on the small appliance circuits. (ones serving the counter tops) Since this is a remodel likely the existing lighting circuit would be adequate.
 
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Old 08-24-17, 10:56 AM
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Thank you for the reply, Mr. Ironhand! The next question I will ask probably is not a valid approach under code but I ask it anyway, mainly as a way to control costs.

One of my breakers in a sub-panel controls the kitchen lights and 2 or 3 outlets in the breakfast area. Another breaker controls 2 outlets on the kitchen counter and two more in the dining room on the opposite side of the kitchen wall. All of this stuff is ungrounded.

I'd like to leave the lights on the original circuits and the dining room outlets on their original circuits. I'd run new grounded circuits from a newly installed 200 amp panel for the outlets and install with GFCI.

It would seem to me that at each old outlet I am removing, I would either find that the existing 14-2 terminates in that outlet, in which case I can follow it back to where it came from and remove it, or I will see that there are wires in and out of the old outlet, for example, heading to the light switch, in which case I'd remove the wires from the outlet box and splice them together. Then I'd install the new circuit and outlet box.

Is this a no-no? I'm not only concerned about code but about safety as well. This is a 60 year old house and every circuit in the place is 14 gauge ungrounded.

Thank you.
 
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Old 08-24-17, 11:34 AM
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Cables are routinely abandoned in place. Both ends must be disconnected and made unusable by shoving back into the wall/ceiling or cutting so short they are unusable.
 

Last edited by ray2047; 08-24-17 at 07:39 PM.
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Old 08-24-17, 07:35 PM
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Remember, ungrounded circuits can not be extended. That means some of my advice above may not be valid.
 
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Old 08-25-17, 06:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Tolyn Ironhand View Post
Remember, ungrounded circuits can not be extended. That means some of my advice above may not be valid.
Ahhh... this is good to know. The lighting plan is to move from a single overhead light in the middle of the kitchen to 3 cans plus a chandelier over the island... so it looks like a wiring job for the lighting as well.

I really appreciate the information. Thank you.
 
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Old 08-26-17, 06:51 AM
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I would suggest #14 and a 15 amp circuit for the lights. Easier to work with.
 
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Old 08-31-17, 10:50 AM
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Folks - getting deeper into planning the electrical part of the remodel, and an additional question has come up. I have a breaker in a sub-panel that feeds 3 outlets on the kitchen counters. The dining room is on the other side of the wall from the kitchen, and the same breaker serves two wall outlets in the dining room.

It appears that the wiring comes from sub-panel to the counter top outlet closest, then daisy chains to counter top outlets further away, then daisy chains to the dining room outlets.

Is it permissible to pull out the kitchen counter top outlets out of the circuit (to be replaced with new wiring) so that the existing (ungrounded) breaker and circuit will continue to supply the dining room outlets (no dining room remodel at all)?

TIA
 
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Old 08-31-17, 11:24 AM
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The dining room receptacles can share with the new kitchen receptacles. Are the current dining room receptacles two prong? If they are three prong (with ground hole) that is a code violation. Putting them on a new kitchen circuit would be one of three ways to remedy the problem if there is grounded receptacles installed in the dining room.
 
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Old 08-31-17, 11:47 AM
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@ray2047 - The dining room outlets are two wire, ungrounded units... no third grounding hole, as are the current kitchen outlets.

If I understand you correctly, I could pull new 20 amp grounded wiring into the kitchen counter tops, then daisy chain the existing non-grounded dining room outlets onto the new circuits?

Again, thank you for your help and expertise.
 
 

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