Black tar like stuff under old kitchen tiles?


  #1  
Old 04-21-16, 12:00 PM
D
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: USA
Posts: 43
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
Black tar like stuff under old kitchen tiles?

Hey guys I got a 1980 built condo/apartment.
The kitchen has 2 layers of tile. The newer layer is made up of real tile and grout, but the old layer under is made out of white ceramic or linoleum I'm not sure what exactly but it has a black tar like layer beneath it. The exposed tar is hard as paint but some of the tar still under is still sticky.

Is this an adhesive from back in the days? It seems like it's been painted on the cement slab first as I see paint brush streaks.
Also is it safe?
If so, should I scrape it all off before putting in the new tiles? Or would the tile mortar just cure over whatever it is.
Is there a special cleaner for this?

Thanks in advance!
 
  #2  
Old 04-21-16, 01:24 PM
ray2047's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: USA
Posts: 29,711
Upvotes: 0
Received 15 Upvotes on 13 Posts
Its cut-back asphalt adhesive. Best to scrape as much as possible. The old books I learned from said it all need to be removed. That was an unholy mess back then using either special solvent for it or a floor machine (buffer) with abrasive disks. Hopefully the pros have a better way now.
 
  #3  
Old 04-21-16, 04:25 PM
D
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: USA
Posts: 43
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
Thanks ray2047 for the quick answer.
 
  #4  
Old 04-21-16, 05:11 PM
sam floor's Avatar
Forum Topic Moderator
Join Date: May 2010
Location: floor installer
Posts: 1,012
Received 37 Upvotes on 31 Posts
Cut-back was full of asbestos. If you scrape it, keep it moist. The dust can be deadly.
 
  #5  
Old 04-21-16, 08:31 PM
D
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: USA
Posts: 43
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
Oh man, ive left part of the cutback exposed all week. I better get somebody to redo the tiles asap.
No wonder somebody just retiled over the easily removable original tiles.
Who should i call? any tile guy or is there a specifically certified professional I should call?
 
  #6  
Old 04-21-16, 08:41 PM
Handyone's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: U.S.
Posts: 4,807
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
It's not like you're in imminent danger having the adhesive exposed.

The important thing is to keep the 'dust' down, which is easy with adhesive. Sam advised keeping it moist and that's a good idea while scraping.
Purchase a quality scraper with extra blades, a professional spray bottle and some quality contractor trash bags.

If you go with a pro, just ask them how they plan to deal with the asbestos.
 
  #7  
Old 04-21-16, 09:20 PM
D
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: USA
Posts: 43
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
Thanks for the info, i was walking all over it all week until i asked about it yesterday. I just put tape over it for now and im guessing the crusty broken tiles are also VAT. I will call the asbestos remover guys tomorrow.
 
  #8  
Old 04-29-16, 09:02 PM
D
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: USA
Posts: 43
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
So I got the tile and mastic checked and the white 12x12 tile had 2% chrysotile and the black mastic had 6% chrysotile.

The guy who came to take samples said it was no big deal unless I start smashing them apart.

So for now I'm going to leave the ceramic tiles that are on top and repair any cracked tiles until I save up enough to get the guys to remove them professionally.

Thanks guys
 
  #9  
Old 05-12-16, 07:42 PM
D
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: USA
Posts: 43
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
Just a little update.

So I left the tiles alone in the kitchen/hall/bathroom area and started removing the bathroom vanity and cabinate which is built into the wall. The tiles ends at the vanity cabinate, (also the kitchen cabinates too)so I was expecting to see concrete under it.
Well lo and behold there was sheet laminate under it! Probably the original floor when it was built in 1980. Had Armstrong written on the back.
It was all crumpled up and the edge was curved in with water damage. I knew it had to be asbestos sheet laminate, and I didn't want to just leave it exposed so I pulled it out wearing a dust mask rolled it up and threw it out asap. Scraped the paper like backing that was stuck to the yellow glue slowly and sealed it with self leveling concrete primer. The primer isn't suppose to be applied to glued or asbesto surface but it sealed up fine, poured SLC to get it as high as the asbestos tiles so the new ceramic tiles will be level.

So I've learned that the original flooring was a beige brick pattern sheet laminate in 1980 and the white 12x12 asbestos tiles with black cutback probably came well after 1980, which is interesting. Even the abetment guy told me asbestos were banned in 1979, it's false. So it's good to make sure if your 80s tiles are not asbestos.
 
  #10  
Old 05-12-16, 08:42 PM
F
Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Wet side of Washington state.
Posts: 16,321
Received 38 Upvotes on 30 Posts
Contrary to popular information asbestos has never been completely banned in the US, there are still many things that contain asbestos being sold. Further, when the curtailment of asbestos-containing materials came into being most of the existing stocks of ACMs were allowed to be used so it is no surprise that you found asbestos in your floor tiles.

Also, the cheap "dust masks" (the ones that look like a bra cup) are useless against asbestos fibers.
 
  #11  
Old 05-13-16, 01:57 AM
D
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: USA
Posts: 43
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
Yes your exactly right, from digging the internet, only the insulation type asbestos were banned and the rest is still used today which is baffling, and majority of the people do not know this. It was weird that I knew more about asbestos than the abetment guy since he believed in the "up to 1979" or the "only 9x9 tiles" myth.
The dust mask, i meant to say the mask with the pink filter.
 
  #12  
Old 05-14-16, 06:11 AM
sam floor's Avatar
Forum Topic Moderator
Join Date: May 2010
Location: floor installer
Posts: 1,012
Received 37 Upvotes on 31 Posts
You are putting ceramic tiles over linoleum and vinyl tiles? Noooooo!
 
  #13  
Old 05-16-16, 09:37 PM
D
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: USA
Posts: 43
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
I already have ceramic tile floors over the 12x12 asbestos tile. Its probably been like that way before the last owner. Im just repairing the area that didnt have the tiles which was under the bathroom cabinet. Im doing this for the time being since the abetment will cost us 3K, and thats just removing and cleaning.

Anyways it just dawned on me that the hallway concrete floor has anorange adhesive residue as the one under the bathroom cabinet which had the armstrong sheet flooring (the original floor 1980).
Is there possibly any asbestos in the orange adhesive? Im not sure if it used to be a different color back in the days but are there examples of Armstrong sheet flooring adhesive having asbestos? because if there was im pretty fudged since ive been walking around the orange residue for about a month...
 
 

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
 
Ask a Question
Question Title:
Description:
Your question will be posted in: